tijnema at gmail.com
Fri Jun 8 08:34:29 PDT 2007
On 6/8/07, Ken Moffat <ken at linuxfromscratch.org> wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 08, 2007 at 10:46:11AM +0200, Tijnema wrote:
> > >
> > > Dan thinks minor glibc version upgrades (2.3.5 to 2.3.6, maybe 2.6
> > > to 2.6.1) are ok.
> > Minor upgrades are more or less bug fixes right? So I think Dan is right.
> In theory, yes they are bug fixes. In practice, I wouldn't want to
> risk hosing a system.
Hmm, Theory != Practice...Good point :)
> > Yes, I'm staying with BLFS for a long time (forever?), I use it as my
> > Server, which is my development machine. The problem for upgrading
> > isn't building the programs itself, but the time it takes to compile,
> > no matter if it's automated or not, it takes days to recompile all the
> > stuff I have installed... I'm only at a good old single core AMD
> > Athlon XP system, which is clocked down to 1.15Ghz with 512MB SD
> > RAM... and I just can't live without the machine for a few days :P
> > It's my server for all kind of stuff, data, music, movies, streaming
> > TV, web, Linux program dev system, etc...
> I understand your time problem.
> > Is there any good way to build the new (B)LFS System next to the old
> > one and replace it later? So that I can keep all old programs running
> > fine, and just build the new one. 2 drives,
> > 1st:
> > /boot (100M)
> > / (60GB)
> > swap (1024 MB)
> > 2nd:
> > /data (500GB)
> I believe that X can now be built successfully in chroot, so
> possibly the whole system could be built in chroot. That isn't
> something I've ever tried.
And then i could simply boot the chrooted partition and run KDE + X
(using nvidia drivers)??
If that's possible it would be a cool solution of course :)
> > So, i just store all data on the 2nd drive as /data, and if it's
> > needed I can split the / in 2 partitions of both 30GB, that's enough
> > to keep my whole (B)LFS system on both. The only question is if it
> > will work, and how to do it.
> > I'm currently at glibc-2.3.6, and I would love to upgrade it to
> > glibc-2.6,
> Why ? I've only built glibc-2.6 on ppc64, to see if it helped with
> the showstopper gcc-4.2 problems (it didn't), but I came across posts
> on diy-linux pointing to some problems, both with itself (maybe
> 2.6.1 will be released) and with its decision to include a version
> of futimens().
I hate old versions :P I want to keep my system up to date, so when I
want to install a small app, i don't need to reinstall my complete
system because glibc is outdated :P
> > I just described the first problem, the second problem is
> > that my server doesn't like working too hard :P If I max load it for
> > some time, it will reset automatically, I'm still not sure where the
> > problem is, I think it gets overheated or such, but this means I can't
> > run GCC4 Test suite while the rest of the system is running, like X,
> > KDE etc. I don't know if it works when i shut down X/KDE. It's not
> > loaded at my normal desktop, both shutdown with some kind of error,
> > but I don't care, because I don't even have a monitor connected to my
> > server anymore. I'm using it by LAN (SSH/VNC), When I'm using VNC, it
> > starts ,of course, X and KDE, and I can't shut it down because that
> > would kill the VNC session. I can't do it through putty either,
> > because I need to keep the putty window open, and since the test suite
> > takes a few hours to complete, it is impossible for me to keep the
> > window open.
> Building headless raises the bar. Certainly sounds like either
> overheating, or an inadequate power supply. Have you opened the
> case up recently, to remove accumulated dust and fluff, and to check
> the fans are working ? Athlons used to be notorious for running
> hot, at least until the pentium4 redefined hot. Do you have adequate
> airflow in the case ? Drives can get hot - I don't totally believe
> the figures reported by smartctl (from smartmontools), but they can
> indicate problems (my via C7 has a 160GB Samsung without a fan in
> front of it which regularly reports temperatures around 48°C even on
> a cool day). A couple of summers ago I set my server to spin down
> the drives if they were running hot, and overnight - I'm much
> happier when I see low temperatures reported. If you haven't already
> upgraded the cpu cooler (to something K7 specific, with a good fan
> and rated for a fast cpu) you could try that. There was a lot of
> development of coolers back in those days, and I don't think your cpu
> speed was top of the range, so it might be possible to get it running
> cooler. Case fans also help (and check that multiple fans are working
> together, e.g. blow in from the front and expel out the back).
Ok, i've built my own case, so it's a little bit different story...
The PC itself is cooled fine, i'm not totally sure about the CPU
itself, but i don't expect it to become way too hot, because it's
already downclocked. It's an Athlon 1800+ (1500Mhz) and now running at
1150 Mhz. Everything in the PC is old shit...
I needed to downclock it because else it didn't want to start...
The original fan of the cooler is defect, i removed the fan and
replaced it by a standard 8cm fan, and i have it just connected to the
power supply itself, and not to the motherboard, so the motherboard
can't detect the speed of the fan :P
The harddrives are supercooled :P, so there's defenitly not a problem there...
I checked the CPU a few times with my hand, and it felt like 30-40
degrees C, so that shouldn't be a problem,. checked GFX card too, is
cool too, did a Memtest, and ram looks good too...
I don't wanna spend money on my server :P, it's just shit plugged together :)
> > So this points me to two things,
> > 1) Will build scripts, like you guys use, resume after a PC restart?
> > Or at least restart from the point the script quit, and not start all
> > over again?
> Mine keep a note of what got built (a file per package to show it
> was completed), so only the current package gets rebuilt. I have a
> lot of overhead in the scripts to support what I originally wanted
> to do! But, that isn't a lot of help if the current package is gcc
> or glibc and it repeatedly overheats. I used to have an AmigaOne
> which turned out to have cooling problems (aside from the usual
> cache coherency issues) - it would suddenly shut down while compiling.
> Unfortunately, by the time I'd realised this was a cooling problem it
> was probably already too late. I can now view it as "good riddence
> to bad rubbish" - I would not say the same thing about an Athlon.
Hmm, it fails on the GCC test suite each time, so your scripts won't
work good enough for me i think. Compiling is no problem at all, Doing
a lot of CPU intensive tasks does make my system restart.
> > 2) Is there a way to set the max load for the system to lets say 80%,
> > so I'm sure it won't restart?
> No idea, and I'm not convinced it would help.
I really think it would help, but i'm not sure if it's possible at all :P
> > Ok, too long email now.. :P
> > Tijnema
> Stay cool!
I will :)
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